Refiner’s Fire Camp Meeting Ministers’ Session Day 5, September 2026 by Apostle Joshua Selman: MP3 Download & Sermon Notes

An X-ray of the current state of the church

Yesterday we redefined the church as a strategy, as a congregation of God's people unified in Christ, and as the institution that preserves the program of God

We listed the assignment of the church. I gave you five out of six

The church has done commendably well through the years. We have seen revivals come and go, awakenings and moves of God upon Nigeria and Africa

Great voices have arisen. Many have joined the cloud of witnesses, many are still alive, and we have received the baton from some of them

Colossians 4:17

Part of my assignment is to bring certain perspectives to the body of Christ and to bring balance. Balance in understanding, balance in various dimensions

3 errors that can proceed from the pulpit

As servants of the living God we must guard jealously that as we minister the word, we do not communicate these errors. They have destroyed many people.

Some who communicated them did not do it intentionally

1. Apostasy

   1 Timothy 4:1

   Falsehood, a deviation from the truth, from the known patterns of God

   Two dimensions: an apostate person and an apostate teaching

   An apostate person is one who was never in Christ or has fully and consciously deviated from the known patterns of God, or a sincere person who has not been trained properly

   You can be a genuine man of God but your teachings can be the doctrine of devils

   If you love the Lord sincerely and you are taught accurately the way of the kingdom, it is easy to get out of this dimension of error

2. Corrupted teachings

   A misappropriation of accurate kingdom principles. The principles are accurate but the approach and the application is where the error comes from

   It takes extra grace and cautiousness not to be a victim of this one.

   You can be a genuine man of God and take a correct kingdom principle but misappropriate it in the approach or the practice

   Honor is a correct kingdom principle, but you can communicate honor in a way that becomes human worship

   Giving is an accurate kingdom principle, but it can be taught in a way that becomes an instrument of manipulation

   The way we have taught giving, honor, deliverance, prayer, fasting: accurate principles, but taught in a way that has produced casualties in the body. This, with the third, is what has plagued men of God

3. Imbalance

   Imbalance, or incomplete communication of truth. Imbalance is an exaggeration

   Illustration: the kitchen

   If I put one mud of rice and one mud of salt, what is wrong with that combination?

   Salt is needed in the food, but I have produced poison out of something that can be a blessing

   If I carry a handful of eba or garri and sprinkle it into a drum of water, it is too insufficient relative to the volume of water

   This is how it has been in church. You can carry something true and stretch it beyond the boundary of its relevance and it begins to destroy.

   Or you downplay the relevance of certain truths and they do not create the impact they should

   Illustration: the phone number

   If you have seven out of the 10 digits of my number, it will not dial me. Even nine out of 10 will not call me. The numbers are accurate but incomplete

   It is dangerous to give people half truth because you can still destroy them with it. Truth must be balanced, it must be wholesome

Dr. David Agui made a statement in passing while ministering in Kenya that stuck to my spirit: if you were given the responsibility to pastor Jesus, will he become the savior?

If Jesus were sent to your congregation as a church member with the destiny of a savior, will your mentorship raise that baby to become Jesus?

If Jesus were in many churches, he would never emerge as a savior. If Joseph were in many congregations, he would die a child.

If David were in many congregations, he would never become a mighty man

The church must be purified

Hebrews 12:5 to Hebrews 12:11

God is a good God and God is our father. One of the ways fathers raise children is to give instructions, but also to correct and rebuke in love

There is no father who wants to raise a responsible child who does not bring the instrument of discipline, correction, rebuke and chastisement

Being without chastisement means no influence of a father, and not sons

Look at the goal and intent behind the chastening of the Lord

Ephesians 5:25 to Ephesians 5:27

Most times we use this scripture only during weddings. While that is profitable, we have lost a more potent application of it

Love was the motivation. Before the issue of love in marriage, this is a principle God uses to purify his bride.

He loves the bride enough to wash her and to cleanse her

6 major areas where the church has been plagued

I did a teaching, The Purified Church, on the six major areas that need adjustment to help the church come into her prophetic destiny.

Here I take a different angle: six major areas where the church has been plagued

The maturity of the church depends on growth in these six areas.

Every attack on the church, every negative news about the church, everything that brings displeasure over the church, comes from one or more of these areas

As much as the church deserves commendation in many areas, there are still areas where God needs to help us

1. Consecration, character and the sincerity of our love for God

   You will never become a matured church when consecration, character and the purity and sincerity of our love for God are found wanting

   Consecration means to be set apart. It has two elements: abstinence from, and devotion unto. We have stressed one and left the other

   Even if you successfully abstain from and are not devoted unto, you are still not consecrated

   What motivated you into ministry

   Many get into ministry because they applied for a job, could not get it, and felt let me just get into ministry. Then they become a casualty to themselves or to others

   Others because someone said you look like a pastor, you talk like a pastor

   Others because they watch the honor that comes with priesthood. Sitting in front, the honorarium.

   A cheaper way to make it in life: why labor when someone I pray for can change my life in one moment

   Others to ease the guilt of a bad past. They served the devil yesterday, so let me serve God today, and the way to do it is to become a pastor

   Regardless of motive, there are non-negotiable requirements if we want to host the glory of God in a way that transforms a generation

   Whatever motivates you into ministry is what sustains you there. If it is money, it sustains you there. If it is the need for a name, it sustains you there

   Many have brought shame and reproach to the name of Jesus and to priesthood because of an intrinsic corruption of their motive. It was never about Jesus, it was never about souls

   2 Timothy 3:4

   I am an advocate of living a comfortable life and enjoying the blessings of the Lord. But the work of priesthood demands sacrifice from start to finish

   If we edit this out of our sermons, we raise very weak people, a generation that cannot stand the test of time

   If you can only live for Jesus, you are not ready for ministry. You must be willing to die for Jesus. Many can live for him but cannot die for him.

   I mean this literally, not just death to flesh

   Most of the vices that destroy ministers start from an intrinsic corruption of the heart.

   Once your heart is corrupt, there is no limit to the many expressions of that corruption in your life

   Immorality, pride, lust, flesh are all powered by one central system of corruption: the absence of the fear of God and of genuine love for Jesus

   There is a way you fear God:

   • You will not manipulate your people for gain
   • You will not trample upon your people because you are looking for gain
   • You will not take advantage of the vulnerability of the people God has planted to you
   • You will not allow people to become like animals because they are worshiping you or acknowledging your greatness

   The gifts of God can make a man look very charismatic. You can preach well, prophesy well, be very intelligent even over doctrinal matters, and yet not be born again

   The correct order of raising mighty men

   Pastors, do not start your journey by teaching believers the way of victory. Teach them:

   • The way of the altar
   • The way of victory
   • The way of purpose

   You don't start by teaching men how to win in life. It is a corruption of the curriculum

   Teach them the way of the altar, the way of death, the way of consecration.

   When their hearts are purified, teach them how to win with the word, knowing the cars and houses have been shielded by their consecration

   Then teach them purpose: the blessings of God are supposed to empower you. There is an agenda and a program

   If you see a congregation successful but not consecrated, something happened from the pulpit. There was a corruption of that pattern

   Before you teach prosperity principles, how to win, how to be CEOs, they must fear God. If not, you are only raising casualties. It is only a matter of time

   The man you are trusting to become a CEO has not died to the flesh

   7 dimensions of victory purchased in redemption

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   Redemption has brought us seven dimensions of victory in seven areas

   • Sin
   • Satan
   • Hell
   • The grave
   • The world
   • The flesh

   And one other. There are seven of them

   The sacrifice is the same, but the dynamics of appropriation are very different.

   The sin nature was dealt with on the cross once and for all, and when you receive Jesus that sin nature dies within you

   The flesh you crucify daily

   You can cast a demon out by one statement, but you don't cast desires out by one statement

   2 Corinthians 4:12

   Most believers do not understand how to appropriate victory over these areas. It is one thing to be saved, but you must know how to be free.

   You can be saved and yet bound by the elements of the flesh

   Illustration: lust

   Lust is predicated upon a desire that has a positive connotation within the context of marriage

   Lying is lying anytime, any day, forever. But lust latches upon a desire that God himself put there and created a boundary for.

   It was not an evil desire. Lust is a manipulated desire, a desire that was set aside to be dispensed within a context for it to be profitable

   So it is not something you just bind and cast out. You sustain the intelligence to tame that desire so that it is only engaged within the context of the provision allowed

   A single man can be suffering from the spirit of lust. A married man who does not have that kind of desire for his wife can have a problem on the home front

   You can be born again and filled with the Holy Spirit

   But if you do not understand the dynamics of taming the flesh, you will be surprised at the kinds of things that can come out of you

   It was said that at one pastors' conference, ministers used the hotel internet, and when the IP addresses were sampled, most of them were IP addresses of adult content

   Most people have not been trained to tame the flesh. They have been trained to live in denial

   What happens largely in the body of Christ is not victory over the flesh. It is hypocrisy for the sake of our reputation. People conform as though victorious whereas they are dying in secret

   The Bible does not call us to hide or pretend over the flesh. It calls us to dominate over the flesh

   A man sees a very pretty lady and tries to deny it. The reality is that she is there. What that beauty does to you is where dominion comes in.

   It can be seen as an expression of God's creation and give you joy without penetrating your heart into lust. Or it can become suggestive and plant lust within you

   Many people we think are all right are not all right. It is a business of endurance and hypocrisy

   Many pastors have not conquered the flesh. Many seem to abstain from the appearance of evil not because they fear God but because they fear their reputation 1 Thessalonians 5:22

   You must love God beyond your reputation. It is good to protect your reputation, but the fear of God is a nobler reason

   2 Timothy 2:19 to 2 Timothy 2:21

   Illustration: the 1 billion naira

   If they drop 1 billion naira, most pastors will say, I don't need money, this money is useless to me.

   While they say that, their heart is saying, look at this money very well because you need it

   The greater call is to know that this is a tool.

   If it will compromise my stand with Jesus, not because I don't need it but because I love him more than it, I will give up that money a thousand times

   So consecration boils down to the genuineness of your love for Jesus. Many are not sleeping around, not drinking, not smoking, yet they are not free because of the corruption locked up in their heart

   The prayer to sanctify your heart is not a prayer for children. It is a prayer for serious people. In consecration there are no generals.

   There are generals of prayer, generals in the miraculous, but in consecration, character and the purity of your walk with Christ, there are no generals. It is a daily work

   It takes mercy to finish

   It takes vision to start. It takes discipline to continue. It takes mercy to finish

   If you live long enough in this program of kingdom come, it will take mercy, even if you are Jesus, to finish

   In my little work in ministry I have seen giants fall. They did not fall because of corruption of their heart. If God does not show you mercy, you will be surprised.

   The variables to be kept at different levels of your life are too many

   It is easy to believe you are a consecrated believer until your wife does not give you a child for 5 years. You will never imagine that one day you can consider consulting Satan.

   This is a business of crying for mercy

   You thought Abraham was such a bad man that Sarah brought him the suggestion of a child with Hagar Genesis 16

   He didn't even pray about it. That means it was already in his heart. It was just how to execute it, with his wife as a stumbling block

   Many people do not have a Sarah. Sarah would say not under my watch, but in your heart you already have 10 children with Hagar

   Brokenness exceeds perfection

   This is why many cannot be trusted with the program of God. In the kingdom, brokenness exceeds perfection Psalm 51:17

   Daniel was a blameless man, a model of a true ambassador of the kingdom. Stainless from the start to the finish of his life. Rich prayer life, prophetic, administrative.

   Yet he was never called a man after God's heart

   The man called a man after God's heart is David 1 Samuel 13:14

   David reported himself before the Lord and sang songs with his sin and iniquity. God said, what kind of a man is this?

   What God is looking for is a broken and a contrite heart

   When I go before the Lord, I don't go as a man of God or as apostle. You are the one who calls me that.

   I get on my knees and say, Father, your boy has come. Search my heart and try my thought. Whatever your verdict is, I believe. I won't argue with you

   If you tell me I'm a thief today, I will start praying the prayer of repentance. I won't say, God, what did I steal?

   God talks from both the plane of the future and the past. When God is speaking to you, don't wait till you see what he says come to pass

   Isaiah began chapter 1 with a strong prophetic word. If you had called him as a colleague to say something is wrong with your spiritual life, he would insult you prophetically Isaiah 1

   You would think God would appear and say, my dear servant Isaiah, I have seen everything you are doing

   But when he saw the glory and the holiness of God, he broke down Isaiah 6:1 to Isaiah 6:7

   His confession was not a lie. It was true. He was a man of unclean lips

   You don't have to be fake to need the help of God. You don't have to be fake to need the mercy of God.

   You don't have to be a sinner to need the mercy of God

   When you cry the cry of mercy, it is not because you have done something morally wrong. It is the secret of consistency in the spirit

   Psalm 19:14

   The words of your mouth can only be known when you speak. But the meditations of your heart? This heart has become a butcher ground for many. Many have killed in this heart

   Many have committed in their heart anything that can be committed. As it is in your heart is already done

   Character beyond the mic

   Be Christlike beyond the mic, beyond the pulpit. There are ministers who only look like God when they are preaching. Once they drop the mic, there is nothing kingdom about their lives Hebrews 12:1

   • I receive grace to live a consecrated life
   • I receive grace to walk in character
   • Lord, I love you sincerely

   We need to go back and search our hearts

   Love is the secret

   The Lord told me years ago, if you will let men see me, there is nothing I will not give you

   One secret about the life of this man: it is not necessarily prayer, or fasting, or the word of God, or study. The real secret is my love for God

   Don't be too quick to say you love him, because he will test it

   I have stood before death face to face on account of the gospel

   Illustration: the road to Maiduguri

   I was in Zaria, leaving to catch a flight in Abuja, and the flight was canceled. I asked the driver to go to Maiduguri to strengthen our family there.

   It was dangerous because they were fighting, but I had told the believers I would come. They were so happy because pastors were not going there, justifiably so

   We passed Kano less than one hour when there was a bomb blast around where we had passed.

   The military had covered everywhere and they could not let us pass, so we slept on the road.

   We did not know whether there would be an ambush

   I said it is possible that tonight I may not even wake up tomorrow. But I said, Lord, if it is for you, I will do it a thousand times

   Don't stand and say I love you, Jesus, in the midst of comfort. Love is tested John 3:16

   He gave his life, his time, his energy, his attention

   Don't just covet graces and dimensions. There are dimensions in the spirit that only lovers can get to. Do you love him enough? Ministry can become idolatry. Preaching can become an idol

   If I can bring you to the point where your love for Jesus is genuine, not motivated by money or titles, then any other blessing that comes, comes

   When I started ministry I never knew there was anything called honorarium. I didn't know they would package rice and bless you.

   I didn't know there was such a thing as a souvenir to take home.

   It was a joy and a privilege to serve God

   Today our hearts have been corrupted greatly. How much will you give me? Not, where does God want me to go

   We need to retrace our steps and return to our first love

   Romans 1:9

   I have never been motivated by money or titles to do ministry

   One of the cancers destroying the body of Christ is the random and reckless ordination of young people purely based on gifts. Nobody is ever qualified enough to serve in ministry, but priesthood has requirements

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   Young people who do not know their left from their right, children leading children, become casualties to the program of God. Beyond zeal, let us make sure young people love God

   People steal in church. Offerings, checks written with no name on them. Only God knows the things that happen in church

   • Lord, purify my heart
   • Let mammon not destroy me
   • Purify my heart that I will love you beyond money, I will love you beyond titles
   • May we love God above and beyond material things, above and beyond money

2. Doctrine and knowledge

   This area is responsible for the stuntedness and the current state of the church. What is the scope of information a believer should acquire? What is the boundary of knowledge?

   We need to be careful with the spiritual materials we bring into our walk with God because of our appetite for knowledge

   Many sincerely have gone out of the boundary of the learning curriculum of the believer, interacted with foreign and strange concepts, and shipped them into the church to show depth of light and revelation

   There needs to be broadness and vastness in understanding. Depending on your ranking and job description you will need to consult many materials, including extra biblical text.

   However, there is a boundary of knowledge for the believer that reveals Jesus

   One of the cancers in the Pentecostal and charismatic circle is almost zero knowledge of doctrine. We teach opinions and personal biases. The church did not come this far on personal biases.

   It is dangerous to teach ideas

   3 layers when you study scripture

   1. The historic or archaeological layer. The Bible is a book of history, of archaeology, putting together events through time
   2. The doctrinal layer. A sequence of foundational truths that reveal God, the state of man, Jesus Christ, God's salvation plan, the believer in Christ and the believer's eternal destiny
   3. The prophetic layer. The Holy Ghost can quicken a verse and take its meaning beyond its usual context, and it can still profit you

   The Pentecostal charismatic circle has focused on the prophetic layer. We pick a scripture and the truths that come out are profitable, believers become victorious, but they are not grounded

   What do you know about God, Satan, the fall of man, the church, sin, salvation, the assignment of the church, the eternal destiny of the church? And who taught you?

   There is a big doctrinal confusion.

   Particularly within Africa there is a strong doctrinal contention, to the point that the average believer, including the average pastor, cannot confidently roll out the truths that represent our statement of faith

   Luke 1:1 to Luke 1:4

   The incarnation and the earth work of Jesus have become a debate. Where was Jesus from age 12 till 30? You have no idea how people have tried to fill that 18 year gap

   Some say he went to India to study under Buddha, citing the similarity between the beatitudes and Buddhist teaching

   Some believers are not sure whether Jesus really came, whether he really died, how many days he was in hell

   There is a pseudo Christian teaching that after Jesus died he went to Europe, with materials claiming an actual grave where he died.

   Others have brought a wife for him and believe Jesus married after his resurrection

   This is dangerous because of the younger generation's appetite for knowledge, for revelation, for something new. In the kingdom it does not have to be new, it should be fresh.

   The focus is freshness, not newness

   Because we have glorified knowledge, there is pressure to search for anything not heard before. Familiar spirits have guided the zeal of people who are not founded doctrinally into virgin dimensions in the spirit.

   They return with encounters and materials, and it brings a cancer to the body of Christ

   It has happened before. Alexander Dowie was greatly used of God, but at a point suggestions started coming and he believed them

   William Branham operated in a strange prophetic dimension, and certain errors proceeded at the end of his ministry. He was a man who would see squirrels appear and run away

   Romans 15:4

   Believers must be anchored on doctrine. Major denominations and Christian bodies must sit down, as in the Jerusalem Council Acts 15. Let us argue it there, but conclude knowing what defines a Christian

   Right now there is confusion over at what point you are called a Christian, matters of salvation and the eternal destiny of the believer.

   It is serious because children are asking questions that cannot be answered

   There are at least 4,000 registered religions on earth, and at least 60% of them are pseudo Christian expressions that diverged through encounters or the study of extra biblical materials

   Extra biblical materials: the annals of the kings, the Dead Sea Scrolls, the book of Jasher, the book of Enoch. Consulting them depends on your level of spiritual maturity.

   If not, you will be so swayed by them that you will be surprised

   When Jesus walked the earth, his name was not J E S U S. English is a very young language. Already some pastors react to a statement like this.

   Others have stopped calling him Jesus in their congregations

   One pseudo sect came up with a system of unifying religions, using the scripture on being one John 17:21. They show that Jesus, other faith founders, Melchizedek and Enoch were brothers in a certain dimension

   Prepare for a generation of learned people. Gone are the days when people say yes because they respect you. They will say, why, pastor? Who was Enoch?

   Somebody told me Enoch was a brother of Jesus

   Defend the faith. This calls for us to settle down and study the scripture ourselves. It will no longer be receive and shout amen. There is a crop of intelligent and inquisitive minds

   They will ask about the triune nature: how can three persons be unified in one? How can God be in heaven and yet live in a man?

   How does God not have a wife and yet Jesus is the son of God? What makes him the son of God?

   We need not just a topical understanding of scripture but a broad understanding. Many believers cannot stand for Jesus because we do not have a strong doctrinal foundation

   In seminary we did the Apostles' Creed. What do you believe about the Christian faith, and why do you believe it?

   Were you born into that belief, or have you found it a personal conviction that this is true?

3. Principles and practices

   How we go about obtaining results, our methods and our strategies. The church needs to define its principles and practices, for example the use of material mediums

   Acceptable ones, like the elements of the sacrament and communion, and then other elements like mantles. What are the defined principles and practices?

   The presence of the Holy Spirit is an advantage to the church.

   But if not engaged properly, it can make the Christian faith a complicated practice, because there is such a thing as God said to me, and if not managed that is a dangerous statement

   Somebody says, God said to me, wear only a blue shoe for one year. By what parameter do you say the person is wrong?

   He said God said, and more so once results come from it

   Personalized dealings

   Personalized dealings are unique dealings God carves out to produce the kind of believer he wants to make out of you. A bespoke training

   The danger is that once you receive results from your personalized dealings, you want to teach others. So it becomes doctrine

   If you ask me how I became a mighty man and I say God gave me the number 55, I fasted 55 days and on the 55th day I encountered power

   Then 55 becomes a prophetic number not governed by scripture, only because I have results to show

   There is a cancer that has come out of trying to create doctrine out of personalized dealings

   God can weigh my heart, see that material things can easily sway me, and tell me, don't own more than three cars, don't own more than three houses. It is not a doctrine.

   It is a unique dealing to keep me consecrated, because of the vulnerability of my person. God has weighed me and found that if I have beyond this, it will corrupt my heart

   Because I keep it, I excel in my spiritual life. So if you ask the secret of the longevity of my impact, I will say three cars, three homes.

   Then those who follow my path reject someone who in his destiny should have a foundation with estates. What blessed someone can destroy another, because it is not doctrine

   Not everybody needs to see an angel to start ministry. Not everybody needs to see a vision. Some of the most powerful ministries on earth had a simple conviction, and some evolved from service

   I may see Jesus Christ and he gives me a direct instruction. I may have angelic encounters. If you ask how I started ministry, I share my encounters.

   A young man can stay there and say, I won't start until I see Jesus, until I see an angel

   You stretch your zeal through fasting and prayer and guess who appears? Satan as an angel of light 2 Corinthians 11:14

   He says, I have come to respond to your hunger. You say, speak Lord, I am listening. He says, your thirst has reached heaven. Now there is a unique way you will do ministry.

   By the time that young man comes down from the mountain, he will create a sect that destroys the body of Christ. And if you ask him, he will argue, I know what I saw

   There are many appearances of Jesus today that are a lie. I can tell you by the authority of scripture, I have seen Jesus.

   There are many supposed visions of heaven, of hell, of angels, of Jesus. The realm of the spirit is a vast realm.

   Just because what you saw did not hurt you does not mean it was God

   There needs to be a definition of principles and practices.

   The Holy Ghost is dynamic in the way he works, but no matter how vast, no matter how dynamic, there is a way God does not work

   Across Africa you see many detestable practices that came as expressions of visions or suggestions. Because there is a similitude of results, you cannot tell those who did it anything.

   These practices have brought reproach to priesthood. I say it as one who is part of us too

   The fact that Smith Wigglesworth swung his hand and punched a dead body and it came back to life does not mean that is how to raise the dead.

   Keep punching people's organs, you will kill somebody and go to jail

   Illustration: the anointing oil

   I saw a photo of a man of God anointing someone with an oil bottle as big as that. He asked the person to kneel and turned the whole bottle over him, head to toe.

   I am not saying the person is bad, but something is wrong with what was done

   Imagine you are a father of five children in a good school, and you return from church looking as if you fell into a gutter. Daddy, what happened?

   I came from church, our lives will change

   Is there something wrong with anointing? No. But that same person has neighbors who are watching, and those he is trying to bring to that church

   Am I still accurate if I preach, don't see any vision, we share the grace and go back home?

   Am I still accurate if I don't say I heard or I saw something and I show you the truth from God's word?

   There is such pressure right now. Our members have contributed to adding that pressure on pastors. Are you going to close this service like this?

   You didn't see anything with your level of ranking in the spirit? And the man says, okay, one moment, let's charge the atmosphere

   Lying visions have come out of pressure

   Spiritual things go beyond the realm of science. There are times God gives instructions. Why do you dance and dance and then a testimony appears? That is beyond the scope of science

   But as dynamic as God is, we have the witness of the spirit and the strength of the word to know what God cannot do. There are things God does not do

   Even in administering the prophetic there is a modus operandi. If God shows me something over the bishop, there is a way to go about it. I cannot talk about it openly before the congregation.

   It is dishonor to his office and to the platform that granted me. These are ministry ethics

   I cannot climb a pulpit, tear the pastors down, tear the east down, tear the bishop down and drop the mic. Don't go to anybody's platform to tear them down.

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   If you don't believe in what they represent, don't receive the invitation. If you receive it, use wisdom to communicate truth within the limit of what is available there

   The church must trust God for grace to become word compliant with our principles and practices

4. The role of the church in societal issues

   Define the role and the level of involvement of the church, particularly in matters of state. Church and State, Impact Beyond Church Walls

   Most believers are not apostolic in their understanding of the church. We have not defined the scope of the role of the church in economy, politics, governance, tech, education

   Some believe the church should never empower people economically. Some frown at it, some advocate it, some are indifferent. There will continually be trouble in the church if we do not define the role

   If a politician walks in and sits near the bishop, there will be mixed reactions. Bishop is backsliding, he is collecting money from politicians. Or, it is good he came, he will be born again.

   Or, bishop stay away, they want you to become governor

   When a pastor is around businessmen, there is a mentality

   The balance: reaching and remaining consecrated

   Many, in the name of being Christian, are found everywhere, even where the church should not be. I'm a light, so you find me in a beer parlor. You find them at a brothel.

   Were you not the one who preached in that crusade? Yes, I'm here as light

   What is the role of the church, and what are the rules of engagement? If a secular artist wants to visit me, should I allow him as a man of God?

   If yes, what should be the scope of my engagement with him?

   The church is a reaching entity, but also a consecrated entity. What is the balance between reaching and remaining consecrated?

   As the church increases, many who come will have all kinds of ideas. I have received invitations to secular programs, fashion programs, business expos. They are not necessarily wrong.

   I tell them it is a nice program, I can pray for you, but the discipline of priesthood does not demand that I be visibly represented there.

   I can wish you well and train the people who get there, but not me

   Jesus at the well with a woman alone is still an issue today. Why was he at the well alone? John 4

   You can't be everywhere. When there is an idol worship program, you see a man of God ably represented there

   Illustration: the airport

   I was waiting to receive someone near an airport, in a state I won't mention. A group had a program. They sang praise and worship, and I was impressed that they loved God

   As soon as they were done they started congratulating themselves, switched to a secular song and brought out alcohol.

   The one who preached a very powerful message and made the altar call was still there, dancing and rejoicing. I said, something needs to change

   If you run away from everybody, who saves them? If you run away from politicians, from prodigal children, who saves them?

   But if you intermingle with them, you may end up in Sodom and Gomorrah like Lot Genesis 19

   There is a balance that must be defined. How should the church reach so that we are not corrupted?

   There are Christians who, once they see a non Christian, show hatred. They mentor others like that. What is this lady doing? She is not properly dressed.

   What is this man doing playing this song in this car?

   Hatred has never been a spiritual strategy. Hatred for people does not birth the glory of God

   But you cannot intermeddle with people because you want to save them. That is another balance. A lady scantily dressed leans on you generously, you in your collar, and takes a selfie.

   You destroy the authenticity of priesthood

   On the other hand, let us not throw away those who are wounded and need to come to Jesus. The key is to reach with caution.

   Let there be love, but remember you are a consecrated entity

   I will not run away from wounded people. If they come for salvation, they are welcome. If they come to leverage priesthood for endorsement, we have enough wisdom to keep them at bay

   There are certain invitations I would rather not take. There are certain people I would rather talk to on the phone. Physical presence would insult the purity of what you stand for

   Secular and sacred mixed in the church

   I love rejoicing. I don't know David's dance, but I know the dance that is not David's dance. I know the dance that came from hell, the dance that sells seduction.

   At the end of that dance more people are going to hell

   I am not saying people should not rejoice.

   I am both old and new school, I am contemporary, but there are certain anchors I will never leave because they represent the purity of the Christian faith

   To the choir and all: we can be contemporary but we must be disciplined and see what we are doing as ministry

   Many who play instruments in church don't listen to the sermon.

   As soon as they play they go behind the church, hang around, drink, stretch their legs, and wait until the pastor is wrapping up, then the keyboard runs in to charge the atmosphere.

   They don't play games with God

   We are servants of the living God. The church should not run away from the world, but must engage the world in a way that does not taint our consecration Matthew 10:16

   Illustration: the baby

   I have one of my little daughters, about 6 years now. About 6 years ago I got a call that a woman had thrown a baby at overflow 3 in Zaria.

   I could go and carry that baby and someone says, apostle, tell us the truth about this story, what is the passion between you and this baby.

   Or I could leave the baby to die there

   I carried the baby, met one of our women and said, please keep this baby, raise her, train her, I will pay to take care of her.

   That girl is 6 years today, a brilliant young girl

   There are many such cases. There are scars I am willing to take for Jesus, but there are certain things I would not do

5. Leadership and governance

   From spiritual fatherhood to mentorship to church structure to succession

   There needs to be a thorough editing of our concept of spiritual fatherhood. If we don't edit it, we will produce a generation of slaves, particularly among the Pentecostal charismatic circles

   Spiritual fatherhood has been used as a subtle system of idolatry. Look at the level of slavery that people, families and businesses have gotten into through aberrated theological teachings.

   There are unwritten rules that sons must keep, and unwritten rules that fathers must keep

   I believe in fatherhood. I believe in mentoring. I believe in spiritual governance. But we need to be careful

   Many young people were introduced into devilish practices because they have to submit to the person who raised them. They know it is not true. They know he is not consecrated.

   They know his visions are lying visions. They see what happens off the pulpit, the discussions, the perversions

   But they are sons. They are told to participate in practices that do not glorify God. They hate it, they cry, but they are sons

   Spiritual fatherhood has blessed the body of Christ, but if not balanced it will produce slaves

   It is that ugly: a woman can get pregnant and the first person to know is another man, not her husband. I cannot tell you the things I have heard in this work of ministry.

   Detestable things

   Adults, successful people, who cannot travel until they are given permission. People who went to school because of a spiritual father and cannot go abroad or vacate their homes.

   People whose men of God hold the bank balances of their accounts, something even their wives don't know. I am not exaggerating, I am not talking to children

   People bankroll the bills of men of God whether they are ready or not, because they are sons.

   People who dare not be heard listening to the message of another man of God or another denomination, or they secure a curse forever, chapter what and verse what, because they are sons.

   This is insecurity that is spiritualized on the pulpit

   I hope I am not describing you. If you are the one, don't feel condemned, but receive grace to retrace your steps

   People wanted to build a house and took the project to the spiritual father, who said forget that house. For 10 years they have no house because they were loyal to a man.

   His knowledge becomes their knowledge. His limitations become their limitation

   When you find a man who loves God and has decided to walk the way of the Lord, please honor that man

   I know churches where people are trying to get visas overseas, not because they want to go overseas but because they want to get out of that place.

   As long as you are in that place, you are a son. They say, if you go anywhere, as your father I must see you, I know where you are.

   That is an aspect of occultism

   2 ways to follow

   1. We look onto Jesus Hebrews 12:2
   2. We follow men as they follow Christ 1 Corinthians 11:1

   Before you follow, keep verifying the person you are following. Who is he following?

   To the younger ministers: respect everybody, don't fight anybody, but be careful not to yoke yourself with a system that drains you spiritually

   There are people bankrupt of versatility of knowledge because of platforms and places, an incomplete and inaccurate understanding of spiritual things.

   You look at them and know a mighty man would have come out if he were broadened in spiritual understanding

   Some would have been great businessmen. But the man was part of a prophetic ministry that said, I have seen you are an intercessor.

   Every time he prays he senses a call to the business world, but because they are sons they lose out on their destiny

   Illustration: the family in London

   Many years ago in London I visited a family. The man told me a pathetic story about a man of God who had manipulated and drained the finances of the family.

   Every time the man of God was to travel there, the family had to pay his ticket, no argument

   He told them their prosperity was tied directly to him, and they believed it and dared not argue

   I prayed for that man and said, I release you from this madness forever. Because of what you have told me, you give me any seed, I won't collect it.

   Maybe next time, but not now, because of the anger of the manipulation you have gone through

   Leadership is a privilege. It is an opportunity to serve people, not to manipulate people. Pastors, serve the people God has given you with humility. Love them. Be there for them. Don't use them.

   Don't manipulate them

   They are not just there to meet your needs. They are there so that you raise them

   If you are doing your job well, God will never allow them to look at you and leave you that way

   If I used prophecy to manipulate everyone, how much could I get from it? I don't speak like this to condemn, but it is the truth

   Church governance

   The death of a leader should not be the death of the assembly. This is why I have profound honor for older ministries like the Anglican Communion, the Catholics, the Methodists.

   They have been there a long time because there is a more robust system of governance that is not pinned to one person

   The absence of one person should not collapse the structure. These are just my contemplations. There is nothing wrong with having a head of a vision

   I heard a story. Someone gave a testimony that a man of God prayed for him.

   A council later called him and said, the testimony was supposed to promote our man of God, and you brought nonsense talk. They punished him.

   The pastor himself never spoke to the person, but there is usually a system that represents the anger of the pastor

   Let us fear God. I am not saying there should be recklessness on the pulpit. There should be order. However, we need to be careful

   Church leadership and governance, particularly in Africa, is the reason churches, like businesses, don't last past 10 years, 5 years. There is no stability.

   It is only the man of God that does everything, so he gets weary till he dies. Don't trust anybody

   If you raise leaders, you have to trust them enough

6. Emotional maturity and the management of differences

   The church needs to gain emotional maturity, especially among pastors, and learn to manage differences in a way that does not violate the position of a Christian

   For far too long there has been a lot of emotional immaturity across denominations, between ministers of the gospel, and a poor management of differences

   Just because I do not agree with your denomination does not mean I should hate you. I have my personal convictions.

   It does not mean I agree with everything, but it is too small a reason to hate

   There are people, groups and denominations that consciously or unconsciously sell an idea of hatred once you do not agree on certain things. It ought not to be so

   We can be different. We can see things differently. Our practices can be different.

   But we must train ourselves to manage differences in a way that does not sell a bad idea of Jesus Christ and how he intends for his church to work

   I have friends who are extroverted, quiet, introverted, youthful and jumpy, collected and mature, lavish and expressive, conservative.

   I have my core convictions, but I have the flexibility to relate to an array of people without compromising my stand and without destroying others

   Everybody cannot be like me. It would make the world a bad place. That diversity is an advantage

   Illustration: the denomination without shoes

   I was invited to preach in a denomination where they don't wear shoes. I accepted the invitation, which means I accepted the implication of going there.

   I will not disregard the place because I am a man of God. I studied how the ministry operates

   If saving souls there is of greater value to me than containing myself, I remove my shoes and go in

   We must have the grace to manage differences. The level of hatred in the body of Christ has almost matched what we have outside the body of Christ.

   Young people hating themselves, pastors hating themselves, denominations hating themselves

   It is like there is an itch. Everybody is waiting to hear that something bad has happened to someone. It should not be so

   The same cancer is eating into the campuses. Young fellowships with arrogance and hatred, because of the mentorship they received

   I have a list of ministries and denominations I sow into. Some don't even know me. I don't necessarily believe everything, but I love them.

   When I see a flyer, I look for the account number and send something. Provided souls will be saved, so be it

   You cannot save a body you hate John 3:16

   Where men of God hate one another, you can't do anything in terms of salvation. Salvation cannot come through the gate of hatred

   Pastors in the east, stop hating yourselves. It happens everywhere, I am only saying it because I am in the east. When I walked in, I went to greet and honor the pastors.

   It does not reduce what I carry

   Don't demean people, rubbish people, or make light of their calling to show you are anointed. It is immaturity

   Whether you are pastoring two people or a stadium full, we are shepherds under one Lord, one faith, one baptism Ephesians 4:5

   There are men of God I love with all my heart but who will not be my friends. The disparity of convictions and character is too wide. I honor them from afar.

   But I cannot get up and hate a church or a man of God for no reason

   Someone says, apostle, they even spoke badly about you. That is not the issue. The most important thing is that the Lord is glorified

   You cannot serve the program of God nationally or globally without love 1 Corinthians 13:13

   You can have power, but it was not power that died on the cross. Where power could not go, love went past it. Not when you pray in tongues, not when you carry revelation.

   Love one for another

   Honor, not outshining

   I would never come and dishonor you. From the youngest of the ministers to everybody, you are deserving of honor

   Years ago I went to preach somewhere

   In a radio or TV interview they made statements as though all the pastors before had been teaching nonsense and they were now about to sit under accurate revelation.

   I rebuked them there and then

   I said, my assignment here is not to outshine. I am only here for 2 days, but there are people who labor here every day. That is why there is a congregation to listen.

   They are deserving of my honor. I came to hold the hands of the priesthood within the territory

   Every time I come to a place, I don't come to outshine. I come to hold the hands of those who labor, and to lift up their hands.

   That is what I have come to do in Oji River

   Men of God, beware of this celebrity mentality. Before my arrival God was moving. If Christ tarries, after I am gone he will still be moving.

   It is a privilege to be found somewhere at the center of his program

   Lord, give us the maturity to show love even in the midst of differences

   If the man is an evil man as a prophet or as a man of God, your assignment is to intercede for him and leave it there.

   If he is wanting in knowledge, your assignment is to pray for him. If you have access to materials that can build him, send them if he has the humility to listen

   The church has fought itself too much. The church is in a state of autoimmune disease, where the body fights itself. Satan is even surprised.

   He is resting because we have made his job easy as we tear ourselves down and blame it on him

   From this conference, men are being refined to love one another

   The next time somebody comes to talk about another church, hold his hand gently and say, I have grown. Let's pray for him. He is doing his best.

   At least he has a heart for God

   When you hear that a woman of God is under attack, and someone says, don't mind her, I don't even believe her, say, let's pray

   Even if they are in error, pray that the grace of God will reach them.

   By the time you begin to raise people after that order, you will have a generation who can be trusted with grace

   The reason we cannot serve the purposes of God beyond certain scopes and spheres is that we don't have love large enough to accommodate the body

   Beware of overestimating yourself

   Be confident, but beware of the danger of overestimation of self. We are ashes without the grace of God.

   Joshua Selman, you are a great man, glory be to God, but be careful so that you do not get to a realm that only God should get to. I know my limits

   Every man of God, manage your greatness with caution and humility. Greatness can do what alcohol does to people. It creates an aberrated view of self

   When I see people who are mighty and yet very humble, they command my respect in a profound way. I have seen prophets, I have seen apostles.

   They carry depth and fire and grace, and their humility is almost charming. I have seen arrogance too, sometimes over nothing

   In a pastors' conference we don't just say, we cry together

Prayer for the church in Nigeria

There needs to be a restoration across these six areas